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July 14, 2009 Plan Comm Minutes July 14, 2009
Town of Germantown
Planning Commission Meeting
July 14, 2009
Chairman Specht called the meting to order at 5:32 p.m.
Roll call vote. Members present: Chairman Specht, Michael Poe,
Margaret Miller, Audrey Scholl, Paul Merk, Jim Collis. Absent- Roger
Bean.
Meeting was properly posted in three posting locations
Minutes of the June 23rd meeting were read. Correction Michael Poe–
1) Castle Rock Island should be Rock Island Lake. 2) Trees 3’ to 12 ‘
should be 5’ to 12’, 3) perimeter not parameter.
Chairman Specht- changes to the record.
Motion made by Michael Poe to approve the minutes with the
corrections.
Second Mr. Collis. Motion carried.
Chairman’s Comments Chairman Specht –read the agenda, comments,
approval, GDP & SIP for discussion and action. MVP District
discussion . Slight change to the agenda, Public Comments moving up
to next on the agenda.
Public Comments Chairman Specht called for public comments for the
General Development Plan and Specific Implementation Plan for Rock
Island Lake.
Paul Blum – W5674 Castle Rock Drive- Somewhat new to this process-
there was a petition circulated and he would like to turn his in. Two
petitions were circulated, one for opposition to Castle Rock Island
Lake and one for opposition to Planned Unit Developments.
1) oppose Rock Island Development – 38.
2) oppose Planned Unit Development indefinitely within the Town 31
Questioned if agenda’s and minutes for the planning committee could be
on the internet as are the Board agenda’s and minutes.
Chairman Specht- We can consider putting on the Town Web page.
Mr. Caravello- 16th – asking the Plan Committee to consider the
berms- they are unclear.
Has done a comparison, pulled grade plans 15th and the north side
compared to Clearwater. Rock Island appears closer in height to
Clearwater’s berm.
Discuss.
Mr. Koopman does not have the most recent landscaping plans. Biggest
issue is height on the plans. Final grade bordering Buckhorn Acres.
Mr. Morrow- They have taken some of the recommendations from the
meeting and have a copy of the plan including those. They have
lowered the berm 4 ft. in places. Highest from road was 9’ to 10 ‘.
Now averaging 7 ft..
Highest 897’ to 899’above sea level with elevation of road.
Michael Poe questioned if 5’ to 1’ maximum?
Mr. Morrow -Landscaping remains the same. Michael Poe - Previous
slope 5’ to1’ maximum adjusted to 6’ to 1’.
Matt Morrow- Lower berm around whole subdivision making a little
flatter. Slope to the ponds, some 8’ to 1’.
Compared to Clearwater 3 to 1 berm, 6 to 1 slope with double the
distance3. Houses average 30 to 40 ft from berm. Adjustment to
subdivisions and how the houses sit compared. 40 ft to base of berm,
varies to 86 ft. Northern edge of Buckhorn Acres is 53 ft to berm.
Discuss setbacks and road right of ways, greater distance-homes to
Buckhorn Acres.
Paul Merk -Creating a greater distance 60 to 90 ft create a greater
buffer for Buckhorn Acres.
Paul Merk questioned if Mr. Koopman checks height of berms.
Mr. Koopman - checks roads and changes to grades. Will be checking
heights of berms.
Paul Merk – reasonable landscape plans- will we be checking up?
Dave Specht – has been on this board five years and not much attention
has been paid until this time. We need to change the policy at the
Town Board level with long range policies to follow up.
Michael Poe – looking at landscaping- 59 trees/ 59 trees/ 61 trees/26
trees starting on the lower left.
Pat Pavloski- they are spaded trees.
Michael Poe – actual projection?
Pat Pavloski – 1st road is spaded, 2nd row spaded, 3rd row spaded
Similar to Stone Gate, slope of fill, what it looks like, planted
25,000 seedlings.
Paul Merk Trees minimum 5 ft?
Pat Pavloski- the spaded trees.
Paul Merk- Would like to see look as natural as possible. 5 ft trees
or bigger. Would like to know how many are the 5 ft or seedlings that
could possible take 20 years to grow.
Pat Pavloski – the Planning Committee could set up so spaded trees are
every x amount of feet a part.
Michael Poe- off set trees in the second row, more natural landscape,
seedlings further fill for more natural look.
Paul Merk goal is to block view of berm. Do you have a vision?
Pat Pavloski-can do spaded tree spacing every twenty feet, minimum
height 5 ft every 20 ft.
Perimeter- more seedlings between.
Pat Pavloski – white pine grow faster.
Paul Merk- stagger, put partly up the berm.
Discuss row between, curves with road, randomization so don’t line up
20 ft. 2nd row same kind of tree. Less like a forest plantation.
Have between another, fill visual impact. Trees going up the berm.
Road, base of berm, 20 ft intervals, parameter-spaded in staggered,
block view up the slope.
Paul Merk- what expected on side slopes?
Pat Pavloski- ˝ ft tall grass
Pat Pavloski- lots are 100 ft wide, sewer in the middle. Plan tree on
the corners of the lots.
Michael Poe questioned failed trees, replacements some fail.
Conditions for upkeep and maintenance- possibly be in the covenants.
Pat Pavloski- in general they will be hard to replace but they have
been very successful on their projects. The bigger trees plant lower,
get into the water.
Michael Poe- what on the most level part of the berm?
Paul Merk- help hide the berm.
Pat Pavloski- tall trees on a hill are hard to keep growing. % for
success rate? 80% then replace.
Michael Poe - Could make a condition.
Audrey Scholl- in the future would like to see when you start clearing
an area to leave a buffer on the edges until absolutely ready to work
the area. This would have less of an impact on the surrounding
areas.
Can do things in pieces. Easily leave existing vegetation until
ready.
Larry Koopman – Will you be able to restore areas, grasses planted?
Pat Pavloski- planned to do that where practical.
Michael Poe – Failed trees?
Pat Pavloski - success rate 80%?
Dave Specht- Stone Gates success rate has been fairly good.
Pat Pavloski- it has been super.
Dave Specht-Waterstone has not had a dead one around the club house.
Pat Pavloski- that area is irrigated.
High Ridge- none died, Stone Gate had 3, Copper Point 2, Clearwater 2
Jim Collis- will this be done in phases?
Pat Pavloski- 3, As it is on the plat map.
Dave Specht- any more comments?
Mr. Curran- Under some time pressure. Shall render a recommendation
to the Board. For the specifics- time is short to see in writing.
The process- vote pending clarification of the conditions.
Dave Specht- conditions should be in simple language. Best to work on
motion and clarify conditions or vise versa
Mr. Curran- conditions first then motions. Conditions to attach to
recommendations
Michael Poe- Conditions:
1.) Require the upkeep and maintenance to sustain the life of
vegetation as the responsibility of
the developer until the property is out of the developers control.
2.) Require replacement of spaded trees at a minimum level of 85% of
those originally planted.
3.) Outer perimeter of spaded trees would have a minimum height of 5
ft. and a maximum space of 20ft. apart at the trunk.
4.) The third row of trees along the new road right-a-way
corresponding to the curvature of the road will be a minimum of 5 ft.
in height and a maximum spacing of 20 ft. apart at the trunk and
spacing shall be staggered with the perimeter trees.
5.) The randomly placed trees, spaced between the perimeter row and
row of seedlings be spaded where possible and spaced between the
perimeter and row of trees .
6.) At least 2000 seedlings will be planted in the row of trees
between the spaded rows.
7.) A revised landscaping plan must be followed according to
specified berm height, elevation and slope per revised plan dated
7-14-09.
8.) A proposed phasing will be developed with the Developer, Town
Engineer and monitored by the Town Board.
9.) Standard Impact Fee Language.
10.) Minimum side yard set back will be 15 feet due to being half as
dense as nearby and surrounding properties.
11.) During clearing of the property a 30 ft buffer of the existing
plants and trees will be maintained along the perimeter of the
development until such time as this area needs to be prepared for
development and planting.
William Bruce-Currently side yard setbacks are 10 ft in other
Districts, outside of the Town Center. PUD’s are 20 ft. The
developer has asked for 15 ft.
Finding of fact of why not following our own rule: Buckhorn Acres,
adjacent subdivision, has twice the density and the set backs are 10
ft. side yard set back. We can allow without hurting the visual
appeal of the neighborhood it is more consistent with the
neighborhood.
Dave Specht-entertain a motion.
Motion made by Michael Poe to approve the General Development Plan and
Specific Implementation Plan for Rock Island Lake with the 11
conditions. Second Jim Collis.
Roll call vote- Merk-yes, Michael Poe-yes, Margaret Miller-yes,
Audrey Scholl- yes, Jim Collis-yes, Dave Specht-yes. Motion carried.
Chairman Specht- due to the time we will have to move the rest of the
agenda, MVP District to our next meeting, second Tuesday of the
month, August 11 at 5:30 p.m.
Motion to adjourn was made by Jim Collis. Second Audrey Scholl.
Motion carried. 7:01 p.m.
Respectfully Submitted,
Marion L. Uphoff
Assistant Clerk/Treasurer